Renowned for his distinct collecting philosophy, Antoine de Galbert takes paths that are well off the beaten track, often in the shadow of art history and oblivious to fashion. “It is subjectivity that should always distinguish a private collection from a public one”, claims the French art collector and patron. Indeed, subjectivity is the key term encapsulating the unique spirit of his collection, which boasts over 3000 artworks. For more than 30 years, he has been bringing together works and objects from as diverse fields as art brut, modern, contemporary, ethnographic, and folk art.
As the founder and chairman of the Antoine de Galbert Foundation, de Galbert also supports art history research and the training of future artists. Between 2004 and 2018, the foundation ran La maison rouge, a visionary art space in the centre of Paris. Exhibitions were organised by independent curators, though always in keeping with the forward-thinking ethos of the foundation’s founder. Although La maison rouge definitively closed its doors to the public a few years ago, the foundation continues to operate with a more personal angle and no strings attached. Antoine de Galbert carries on expressing his lifelong passion and love for art and subjectivity across the board.
The interview was originally printed in Contemporary Lynx Magazine 1(15) 2021. We revisit it on the occasion of the Fondation Antoine de Galbert’s donation of Jean Chatelus’ collection to the Centre Pompidou, which presents it to the public till June 30, 2025.
Marek Wołyński: Since the 1980s, you have been active both as a collector and art programmer — the driving force that is your gallery in Grenoble, the foundation — La maison rouge, and many other initiatives. What motivates you to concentrate all your activities around art?
Antoine de Galbert: I think I would have left art a long time ago if I knew how to answer your question. I have felt for decades that I have never lived outside of art, that I was born into it, and that I have never worked anywhere else. I took refuge there to flee from the reality of people and the world. The traces of human beings, the artworks, are much more beautiful than their authors.
MW: Your collection has significantly evolved over the years. While you began with primitive and ethnographic art, your collecting journey expanded to gradually include more and more contemporary art. Was there a particular turning point that shifted your attention towards contemporary art, or was it more of an organic process?
AdG: The more years pass, the more I try to decompartmentalise the arts. The work of a young video artist can interest me as much as an Oceanian skull or a work of outsider art. Contemporary art is only the continuation of the rest; it didn’t fall from the sky in the Sixties, but its conceptualisation still needs some explanation. When I started out, I had not received any initiation, being perfectly self-taught.
“I have felt for decades that I have never lived outside of art, that I was born into it, and that I have never worked anywhere else.”
— Antoine de Galbert
MW: Your collection distinguishes itself from many others. What, in your view, constitutes a good art collection? What has to be done to create a collection that is alive — one that goes beyond the simple accumulation of financial capital?
AdG: The least you can do to create a good collection is to make it different from others. I would foolishly say ‘buy what you like,’ but of course, this is not enough. The act of buying can be subjective and costly, but must be based on a true visual memory and knowledge of the field. You have to see and see again, approach and feel. But none of this can prevent bad taste and lack of vision. I have studied many private collections, and some with treasures from the art market did not interest me. I believe that a collector must allow himself to re-read the history of art by bringing together works or objects that, without him, would not have become close friends. The collector is not an artist, but his collection must “make work” in order to exist. The best collections are those that no one could make again, even with all the money in the world.
MW: You often describe your relationship with the art market in conflicting terms. On the one hand, you are part of the system and have to participate in market activities to acquire new works. On the other hand, you criticise the unimaginable scale of money involved. Why does the current system irritate you? What could be done (if anything at all) to make it better?
AdG: The art and the market are a paradoxical and inseparable couple. What I criticise is not the existence of the market, which interests me a lot and is essential to me, but the artificiality with which the financial quotations are elaborated. There are two markets: the first one acts in the short term, is known as “speculative”, and is often uncultivated, polluted by fashion and manipulated by “gold makers”; the second one acts in the long term, and is magnificent and more moral, because it allows time for history to be written, and its collectors do not buy to resell, but to be surrounded by works.
MW: La maison rouge boasted intellectually vigorous and conceptually adventurous art programming. One could easily write a book about the unparalleled exhibitions and exceptional events that happened there. You kept away from compartmentalising ways of thinking about art and created a place that functioned beyond divisions of primitive, outsider, conceptual, and even neon art. What inspired you to design and develop such a visionary approach?
AdG: La maison rouge was a miracle. My team could confirm that I had no strategy, no preconceived ideas about what it should be. I would have been quite incapable of writing anything theoretical, on what came from an intimate conviction. I would never have thought that one day lines of visitors would form in front of our doors. And that’s precisely why the public came. I never imagined that I would be right in my programming choices, but La maison rouge has shown that it is possible to bring as many people as possible to join the subjectivity of a single person. Some even said they didn’t really like my exhibitions, but they didn’t miss any. I loathe the arty scene, the hipness, the fashion. Many followed us, and it became trendy not to. Contemporary art is in vogue, will it one day become old-fashioned?
MW: Your openness to unconventional ways of presenting art, especially works from your collection, has gathered considerable attention. For Le Mur for example, you daringly used a mathematical algorithm to arrange hundreds of works from your collection. L’intime, in turn, gave an insight into the intimate relation between collectors and their works by literally relocating collectors’ bedrooms and toilets to La maison rouge. Why are innovative ways of presenting artworks — designing a unique experience for visitors — so important?
AdG: During the almost 15 years of exhibitions, two of them were probably more important than the others. L’intime, le collectionneur derrière la porte, the inaugural exhibition in 2004, curated by Paula Aisemberg and Gérard Wacjman, restored to the public, who had become voyeurs, some 15 universes inhabited by private collectors. This exhibition dealt with the collector’s intimacy with his works, and deplored the loss of domesticity of the most contemporary works of art (installations, gigantism, etc.), which are now destined for huge capitalist fortunes, with premises worthy of the greatest museums.
Le mur, the exhibition that I invented to celebrate the 10th anniversary of La maison rouge, was a kind of dangerous game, because the majority of the mural works in my collection were displayed, without taking into consideration their artistic or financial value, in a randomness dictated by a software program. I was very scared, and then I was delighted because it worked. Most collectors lie about their first acquisitions, abandon artists when they are out of fashion, and many are cowardly and unfaithful. On this Wall, Fontana or Dubuffet were neighbours with young or unknown artists. Many of the works on it were no longer of relevance to me; I wouldn’t buy them today, but I still love them. As if they were living beings, to criticise those whom one loved in the past would be total cowardice.
“The best collections are those that no one could make again, even with all the money in the world.”
— Antoine de Galbert
MW: Freed from the intensive activities of La maison rouge, you and your foundation have more time to focus on other projects. Your collection travels the world and was recently exhibited in the Museum of Art in Łódź, Poland. Are you planning any other touring exhibitions? What projects is the foundation developing for the near future?
AdG: Regarding the collection, it is important to say that we lend hundreds of works every year. It is a big job, which makes this collection almost of public utility because most of the loans are for public places in France and abroad. I am also beginning to organise donations to the Centre Pompidou, the Musée de Grenoble, and the Musée des Confluences in Lyon.
Among the collection’s exhibition projects, Jean-Hubert Martin has just offered me an exhibition in June 2021 at the Château d’Oiron, whose collection he created a long time ago. It will present works in the spirit of curiosity cabinets. Finally, the foundation confirms its support for art education, publishing, and certain exhibitions. We also participate in the enrichment of museum collections. We are now editing a collection of monographs, Un certain désordre (limited editions will be distributed via our online bookshop). The first two issues are dedicated to Mari Katayama and John Isaacs.
MW: Recently, we have all been adapting to new and continuously changing circumstances. The pandemic has led to a proliferation of online shows, auctions, and art fairs. Both the digital versions of works created in traditional media and digital artworks have become omnipresent. Has the global pandemic influenced the way you collect art or the type of artworks you collect?
AdG: Sometimes I have acquired works online to help artists or healthcare providers during the pandemic, but I believe that once the health crisis is over, the market will function as it did before.
